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25d Ford Cortina

Is it genuine or is it fake?

25d Ford Cortina

Postby johnboy » Sun Jun 12, 2016 10:11 am

Reading the other threads about the Cortina reminded me of this one I've had for a few years. It was as cheap as chips. What do you think?
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby Idris » Sun Jun 12, 2016 10:37 am

There is someone on Ebay (I can't remember who just at this moment, but he is one of the known fakers) who knocks these out fairly regularly (together with an equal number of metallic brown SF examples).
Looking at the model above, I am wondering about the shape of the inside of the baseplate rivet. On the metallic brown model, it appears to have a smooth, almost conical profile, whereas the metallic blue example seems to have a step in it.
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby kwakers » Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:03 pm

The rivet on your blue example looks like it was spun dead center and quite perfectly John, whereas the brown one you compare it to has been spun a bit off center. The blue rivet is not of the much flatter early Superfast style either, so it was done using standard regular wheel tooling at the Lesney factory. If the blue model's "Spun" axle ends look as correct as that rivet appears here, you may have been hiding an original playworn Houghton code 7 oddity all these years John. The wear on all the tires match the body wear, so I do not suspect an older "after the factory" fake on this one at all. Could these blue Cortinas be a real paint trial run that slipped out of the Lesney factory in very small numbers? I would hope that there are veteran collectors like Phillip Bowdidge and Nigel who could confirm a single model that may have been found years ago similar to yours John. It's best to ask around and get in contact with those familiar enough with Houghton's work to try and confirm these genuine examples before the modern Fakers completely kill their (possible and legitimate?) place in Lesney History.
Much like the 75 Red Ferarri found in Lesney RW Racing sets and in Blisters out of Canada, could a small quantity of these #25 blue trial bodies been used to complete unexpected orders on Lesney Vacation sets in late 1969?? I really don't think they appear in numbers to indicate that was their source, so a paint trial run is still my favorite THEORY on a blue regular wheel 25 Cortina.....kwakers
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby GHOSTHUNTER » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:20 pm

I would concentrate on the (A) at the front of the baseplate. The blue model has it further forward than that on the Brown model (is this where it is on 'Superfast' baseplates?), so we need members with several examples to show us their baseplates that include 'RW' and 'SF' models.

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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby johnboy » Thu Jun 16, 2016 1:00 pm

I don't remember who I bought this from but I think I do recall the seller you're referring to Hugh. Thanks for the info Dick, I'll put this one on the "To be Investigated" shelf.
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby yellowfoden » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:17 pm

johnboy wrote:Thanks for the info Dick, I'll put this one on the "To be Investigated" shelf.


Hello John,

Following on from Dick’s post it would be interesting to know if the roof rivet detail on yours is the same as code 7 John Houghton catalogue.
These are:
25d-7 metallic light blue, black 10x36 wheels, oval rivet hole in window plastic, domed rivet post ( more like a location pip or stud) with studs (behind rear wheels).

John I can’t quite see from your pics but does your blue rw25d have the studs in boot area please?

I have attached a drawing which is like the Stannard type C rivet area which Houghton refers to. Also attached is the superfast roof rivet area which is smooth for comparison.

Bert
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby johnboy » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:49 pm

Hello Bert, thanks for the interest. This does have studs but no roof fixing, just a round hole.
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby kwakers » Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:58 am

The high and the low A on the base of these 25 Cortinas is a casting variation I had also reported to Nick six years ago, but our collection roster has been in hiding since April's Spring Carlisle Show. In that modified Stannard Guide I have kept track of which codes I have with the "Early", and then the "later" base location of the letter A. As a guess based on your 'smooth' inside roof casting John, I think your body is an early Superfast casting that was used on a stock regular wheel base. It is strange it does not have the later raised hood and trunk lines, but more study is needed on those two body types also. Nick states at his site that both type hood and trunk lines were used on ALL codes, but that statement is totally incorrect and must be removed. The raised type body line body casting appeared on small numbers of the very last code regular wheel Cortinas produced, and are very hard to locate here in the U.S. We had found none in our stores in the 60s, so bought one out of an old veteran collector's collection sell-off. He had never heard of the raised body lines because all of our U.S. Guides, and even Mike Stannard's 1985 U.K. Guide had missed these last raised type of body lines.
Off to find my old collection "Bible" so I can be seen clutching it at the next Toy Show I attend!
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Re: 25d Ford Cortina

Postby motorman » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:22 am

I know that Superfast isn't your thing Dick but I am very interested in your comments because for years I have dismissed any metallic brown Superfast #25 Ford Cortina GT's with the engraved boot line as being likely base swaps onto an RW body. I have only ever considered the Superfast models to be genuine if the have the raised boot line. Am I correct?
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